On July 3rd, 2004, Fr. John Catoir was the keynote speaker at the North American Conference of Separated and Divorced Catholics' 30th Anniversary International Conference. He earned his Doctorate of Canon Law from Catholic University in Washington, DC in 1964. From 1963-1973 he was chief Judge in the Diocesan Marriage Tribunal for the Diocese of Paterson New Jersey. (bio)
| Correpondence between Fr. Catoir and Sheryl Temaat | Sheryl's Commentary (see summary) |
| July 20, 2004
Dear Fr. Catoir: Recently someone sent me your article "Understanding annulments" which appeared in the September 1998 St. Anthony Messenger. I refer to the section on the internal forum in which you explain how couples in civil marriages can receive the Eucharist after talking with a priest or counsel "about whether to proceed on the basis of conscience or the internal forum." I found the article very helpful. I have one serious question, however, that I hope you won't mind answering for me. Few people would have given or taken the advice you offer in the article before, let's say Vatican II, because of the fear of hell. I didn't find anything in the article that would ease that fear. How does one know that proceeding on the basis of conscience in a matter like this won't damn his or her soul? As you say, "This is a violation of Catholic law, and technically, they are living in sin." I sent this letter by post yesterday, but since you have been kind enough to send me your e-maiI, I am sending it again. Sincerely, Sheryl Temaat |
I wrote Fr. Catoir
about his article on the internal forum, "Understanding annulments," St.
Anthony Messenger, September 1998. In that article Fr. Catoir recommends
that couples married outside the Church can receive the Eucharist after
talking with a priest and deciding that they are, in good conscience, able
to do that.
My question was about whether they are in danger of damning their souls since they are, as he said, "technically. . .living in sin." |
| Jul 21, 2004
Subject: Re: Here I am. Dear Sheryl, The question is whether or not your first marriage was a truly canonical marriage. Tribunals exist to answer that question. Some people have a good case but can't get it through the tribunal process. That makes it a matter of justice vs injustice. The Church teaches that when in doubt, it is morally permissable to follow freedom. To apply this to your case one would have to know all the facts before you would be eligible to exercise a good conscience solution. God's inner light will guide you. I have no golden wand. This is a matter of law and fact. Tell me why you don't have an annulment? Blessings and peace Fr. Catoir P.S. My web site is www.messengerofjoy.com in case you can use something there. |
He replied that the question is whether or not my first marriage was a truly canonical marriage. He did not answer my question. He said that to apply the internal forum solution to my case "one would have to know all the facts before you would be eligible to exercise a good conscience solution. God's inner light will guide you. I have no golden wand. This is a matter of law and fact." (Whatever that means.) |
| Jul 25, 2004
Subject: Re: WHERE AM I GOING? Dear Fr. Catoir All I want to know is this: If I go to bed with the love of my life (married civilly but not in the Church) and die, will I wake up in hell? Sheryl |
|
| Jul 26, 2004
Subject: Re: WHERE AM I GOING? Dear Sheryl, NO! St. John says, "Where love is God is?" Blessings and peace. Father Catoir |
The question mark must be a typo. |
| Jul 28, 2004
Dear Fr. Catoir You have assured me that I won't go to hell because of my marriage outside the Church as long as I love the man. Does it follow then that a man who truly loves another man, or a woman, a woman, that there is no place in hell for them as well? Sheryl |
|
| Jul 29, 2004
Dear Sheryl, I don't know, your question is so all-inclusive. This I do know. When there is no malice involved you can depend on the fact that where God is love is, and where love is, God is. Let it rest. |
I'm not through yet. I want to know about adults "loving" adolescents, as in what is called priest sex abuse. How can that be wrong according to Fr. Catoir's mind? |
| Aug 2, 2004
2:20:30 PM US/Eastern
Dear Fr. Catoir, You have said that I won't go to hell because of my marriage outside the Church and that homosexuals won't go there as long as there is no malice in their love. If I have misunderstood you, please correct me. I have one further question that I cannot understand given the above advice from you. Why, would it be wrong then, given the above emphasis on love and avoidance of malice, for an adult to engage in a sexual relationship with an adolescent? Sheryl |
|
| Aug 2, 2004 7:44:26 PM US/Eastern
Dear Sheryl, I think there would be malice in child abuse, don't you? This conversation is over. Follow your conscience, and forget about the idea that God is love You're on your own. God bless you. Father Catoir |
|
| Aug 3, 2004 9:37 AM US/Eastern
Subject: Re: Where is your love? Dear Fr. Catoir, I think there was malice in your internal forum article. Do you have any idea how many children cry themselves to sleep at night because Mom is with some guy, and Dad is with some woman, instead of being faithful to the vows they made to love each other until death? And when I point out that it is your kind of thinking that has led to the priest sex abuse scandal, you tell me to get lost. Geoffrey Chaucer wrote in his Canterbury Tales that there is a nest of priests right under the devil's tail. Sheryl |
|
| Aug 3, 2004 9:54 AM US/Eastern
Subject: Re: Where is your love? Dear Sheryl, I deserved that. I apologize for my rudeness. You make a very good point, and I will give it much serious thought. Thank you for your candid judgment. When the Church approved the concept of freedom of conscience, it did not thereby imply that we are therefore free to sin. I never said that it did. But can an abandoned spouse begin again even if an inept tribunal rejects her plea? I have to turn to the mercy of Christ and say "having done everything she could, let her follow her conscience." God bless you Father Catoir |
|
| Aug 3, 2004 11:10:20 AM US/Eastern
Dear Fr. Catoir: I don't know where the Church approved the freedom of conscience as you apply it. It is our responsibility to correct conscience that is not properly formed. As to the woman who is wronged and cannot get a declaration of nullity from an inept tribunal, when you allow one person to "follow her conscience" and marry outside the Church and receive the Holy Eucharist, you've already opened the can of worms for everyone. I wish I knew where these inept tribunals are that turn down petitions. Everyone I know gets a declaration of nullity for reasons that my husband and I have overcome in our struggle to stay married. Sheryl |
|
| Aug 3, 2004 11:29 AM US/Eastern
Subject: Re: Wronged woman Dear Sheryl, There is the Declaration on Religious Freedom which you will find in the Second Vatican Council Documents. And a few more things written by saints and scholars. I just wrote a column and thought it might interest you, because it was inspired by your reaction to me. I hope it doesn't offend in any way. God bless you. Father Catoir |
Vatican
II. "That discernment in matters of faith is aroused and sustained
by the Spirit of truth. It is exercised under the guidance of the sacred
teaching authority, in faithful and respectful obedience to which the people
of God accepts that which is not just the word of men but truly the word
of God." (Lumen Gentium, no. 12, paragraph 2)
"The laity should, as all Christians, promptly accept in Christian obedience decisions of their spiritual shepherds, since they are representatives of Christ as well as teachers and rulers in the Church." (Lumen Gentium, no. 37, paragraph 2; |
| Aug 3, 2004 12:18:12 PM US/Eastern
Subject: Re: Wronged woman Dear Fr. Catoir: Yes, Fr. Catoir, I'm aware of how the Declaration on Religious Freedom has been interpreted by some. Saints and scholars have written that a divorced woman can marry outside the Church and receive the Holy Eucharist? Who? Where? And where is your column appearing? Sheryl |
|
| Aug 5, 2004 4:03:01 PM US/Eastern
Subject: Thank you for letting me know Dear Fr. Catoir: Thank you for letting me know that my attachment didn't work. Here is the letter I wrote The Beacon in response to yours. I hope I have the right newspaper. The Beacon Dear Ms. Rhine: Fr. John Catoir, in his recent letter to your publication, cited # 1782 of the Catechism of the Catholic Church on conscience: "Man has the right to act in conscience, and in freedom, so as personally to make moral decisions." This section has to do with civil governments and their responsibility not to interfere with the religious decisions and consciences of adherents to a religion. It does not refer to an individual's right to do evil and call it good as Fr. Catoir interprets freedom of conscience. A section that does refer to individual formation of conscience is #1783 of the Catechism which says: "The education of conscience is indispensable for human beings who are subjected to negative influences and tempted by sin to prefer their own judgment and to reject authoritative teachings." Fr. Catoir would not cite this section because it holds him guilty of leading Catholics into sin as in the birth control issue which he condones in the fourth paragraph of his letter. And to refer to St. Alphonsus Liguori to support his dissent is ludicrous. St. Alphonsus was so intent on leading souls to heaven and away from hell that his writings condemn Fr. Catoir's thinking on nearly every page like, for example: "God shows mercy to those who fear him, but not to those who avail themselves of his mercy to banish the fear of God from their hearts." Preparation for Death, "Abuse of Divine Mercy", The Redemptorist Fathers, p. 172. Fr. Catoir is responsible for the priest sex-abuse scandal whether he realizes it or not because he thinks that freedom of conscience allows one to do evil (use artificial contraceptives) for "good" reasons. Doesn't he realize that guilty priests also had their "good" reasons for having sexual relationships with children and adolescent boys. You cannot excuse one evil, Fr. Catoir, without excusing all evils. Sincerely, Mrs. Sheryl Temaat |
|
| Aug 6, 2004 11:14:13 AM US/Eastern
Subject: Re: Thank you for letting me know Dear Mrs. Temaat, It is really unfair to compare birth control to child abuse. There is malice present in priest child abuse, I can see no excuse for it, and no mitigating circumstance. The same is true of abortion.The issue of culpability is in God's hands. I deplore them both, and see them as monstrous evils. I thank you nevertheless for your forthright spirit. May the Lord be your strength and your joy. Sincerely in Christ, Fr. John Catoir |
|
| Aug 6, 2004 12:29:58 PM US/Easter
Subject: Re: Thank you for letting me know Dear Fr. Catoir: A person can sin without malice as in the sin of masturbation. The Church has defined sin, not you or me. You are leading souls to hell, and I am determined to help you see that and retract the evil advice you have given to so many. You excuse one mortal sin, birth control (and it is malice against the man who is murdered before he is conceived as St. John Chrysostom taught), and you have to excuse all sin, Including what homosexuals do to adults, adolescents, or children. Sheryl |
|
| Aug 6, 2004 12:29:58 PM US/Eastern
Subject: Re: Thank you for letting me know Fr. Catoir: A person can sin without malice as in the sin of masturbation. The Church has defined sin, not you or me. You are leading souls to hell, and I am determined to help you see that and retract the evil advice you have given to so many. You excuse one mortal sin, birth control (and it is malice against the man who is murdered before he is conceived as St. John Chrysostom taught), and you have to excuse all sin, Including what homosexuals do to adults, adolescents, or children. Sheryl |
|
| Aug 6, 2004 12:38:40 PM
Subject: Culpability Fr. Catoir: Even when you state something emphatically as in "I can see no excuse for it and no mitigating circumstance. The same is true of abortion," you add something that takes the sting out of what you just said as in ,"The issue of culpability is in God's hands," which is another way of saying that God may not hold such people culpable or to blame. Well, then. . . . We've lost that argument, haven't we. We already know that. Why not imitate St. Alphonsus and let them know what kind of miserable eternity they are preparing for themselves. On the other hand, to say that you "can see no excuse for it (priest sex abuse) leaves the door wide open for the priests themselves to see an excuse for it, in their case, of course. It doesn't matter what you see or don't see; it matters what Jesus teaches through His Church. If you will forgive my preaching to you. Sheryl |
|
| Aug 8, 2004 3:51:02 PM US/Eastern
Fr. Catoir, I wondered what your reaction to my stating that there can be sin without malice would be. Particularly the sin I mentioned. You want to be rid of me again. Sheryl |
|
| Aug 8, 2004 3:53:18 PM US/Eastern
To Sheryl Why would I invite you to talk to me if I wanted to get rid of you again? Talk to me. JC |
|
| Aug 9, 2004 1:55:01 PM US/Eastern
Subject: Re: PEOPLE WHO DESERVE COMPASSION.WPD Dear Sheryl, It happened again. I clicked your message up and a blank page appeared. Go figure??? I'll be away next week, but I do extend my best wishes, and invite you to tell me your story, if you care to. Blessings of peace and joy to you. The Gospels tell us that God is love. He is not vengeful, or brooding. St. Paul said, God wants all his children to come to the knowledge of the truth, and be saved. In His Love, Father John Catoir |
|
| Aug 9, 2004 2:00:30 PM US/Eastern
Dear Fr. Catoir Marie has spent her nights alone for the past 10 years. After 32 years of marriage, her husband Vic renewed an old acquaintance with a woman from his past and decided that he had not been happy with Marie all those years. You could have fooled the rest of us who knew them much better than the tribunal that declared their marriage null for failure to form a communion of life. What a travesty. Veronica's husband Bob walked out on her because he wanted another woman. He filed for divorce and a declaration of nullity which the tribunals granted. Knowing that they did not have grounds for nullity, Veronica appealed to Rome and the marriage was declared valid. Veronica lives a life of celibacy, while Bob and his partner in adultery are active in the parish Catholic Church with the support of the priests and parishioners. Mike's wife Arlene became hateful to him, divorced him, and petitioned for a declaration of nullity. Mark told her and the priest advising her that he would appeal to Rome. The petition was dropped. Arlene had begun dating and became pregnant with another man's child. The other man is no longer in their lives, but in the meantime Arlene took that child and her and Mike's daughter to another state. Mike followed in order to continue to be a father to their daughter. He lives in celibacy, praying for a reconciliation even willing to be a father to the out-of-wedlock child his separated spouse bore. These and several others whom I know who live the Church's teachings in complete fidelity and sacrifice, as the saints did, have my compassion. Fr. Catoir, have a blessed vacation. Sheryl |
|
| Aug 9, 2004 4:13:19 PM US/Eastern
To Sheryl Thank you. |
|